Tuesday, February 24, 2009

Bishop Williamson on the Way to the UK to Meet So-Called Lady Renouf and David Irving

According to the London Times, Bishop Williamson is on his way to the UK where he will meet up with David Irving's buddy Lady Renouf, who simultaneously denied she is an antisemite and yet describes Judaism as a "pugnant and hate-filled religion”

He has turned to Irving for advice on how to understand the history of the Holocaust. According to the Times Irving and Williamson have been in e-mail contact.
“About a week ago I sent him a lengthy e-mail telling him what he could safely say. He should not be quoted as saying things which are not tenable. I sent two pages telling him what is incontrovertible fact. I got a message back thanking me.”
I predicted that he would "see the light" in order to help smooth SSSX's way into the Vatican's good graces. I was, it appears, very very wrong.

This guy may emerge as Irving's successor.

13 comments:

StGuyFawkes said...

I'll mention something I've been holding back.

One predicate in canon law allowing excommunication is "scandal". Scandal is defined as acting in a conspicuously sinful way that might lead other Catholics to think one can be a Catholic and also believe, or act in the conspicuous and scandalous way.

The usual canditates for this are gangsters and pro-choice politicians who never miss Mass.

It appears to me that Williamson is starting to put himself in danger of a "denunciation for scandal".

It would be a fresh excommunication for a fresh charge but it looks like his Excellancy Richard Williamson is begging for it.

And he's totally backstabbing Bp. Fellay whom he promised to not embarrass.

The only thing missing is that the Pope would have to call Holocaust Denial a willful sin of lying.

Now is the time for Jewish groups and friendly Catholics to approach a canon lawyer in Rome and ask frsubmit a "denunciation" to the courts.

In the meantime it looks like Williamson is beginning a schism of his own. He will inherit the more "cultish" members of the SSPX.

And the rest of the SSPX will come in.

Guy said...

I thought SSPX was already back in the Vatican's good graces. It would be nice if the Vatican re-excommunicated them, but that might bring doubt the claim that the Church is infallible. Then again, wasn't the un-excommunication proof that the Church that excommunicated them was fallible?

Ludovic said...

In the following interview with newspaper Kölner Stadt-Anzeiger, canon law professor Peter Krämer of Trier university, says that the church authorities have a duty to react when the dignity of human being is injured, and they could discipline Richard Williamson with measures going from a several year long speech ban, to excommunication.

"Papst kann mehrjähriges Redeverbot verhängen" 06-02-2009 http://www.ksta.de/html/artikel/1233911279233.shtml

StGuyFawkes said...

Guy,

The doctrine of infallibity is misunderstood even by Catholics.

Papal infallibility only applies to teachings on Faith or Morals and then only when a very special declaration is made stating that the Papal ruling is "ex cathedra" or "from the throne". It's only been invoked once in 2000 years.

There is another general understanding that the Church won't fly off the rails with regards to doctrine. But that is different. It all comes from a statement of Jesus that "I will always be with you."

So in short, the Church has and will mess up again and again. However it is an article of Faith that the Holy Spirit will protect it from errors of religions doctrine, not practice.

My suggestion was that Bp. Williamson be excommunicated for a new set of public and scandalous lies.

FAIIRPLAY said...

The Daily Mail newspaper, London are reporting that Williamson's been told to get out of Argentina, deported, for bringing Argentina into disrepute by 'denying the Holocaust'. It appears that he's now on an airplane and heading for the UK. Willamson's London arrival may be reported on tonights main evening news. Guessing I'd say the Pope or some senior Catholic clergyman is behind this deportation because he brought the Pope, and the Catholic Church into disrepute. Feb 25 2009.

Guy said...

Hmmm. Thanks StGuyFawkes. I hadn't known that.

mugwort said...

"My suggestion was that Bp. Williamson be excommunicated for a new set of public and scandalous lies."

Do you really think the Bishop is deliberately lying? What would his motivation be for doing so? Isn't it more likely that he believes what he is saying?

If so, you have to hand it to him for not backing down in the face of threats against not only his situation in the church, but even his liberty if he is prosecuted in Germany under their Holocaust denial laws. Why would he risk this if he does not sincerely believe what he says?

StGuyFawkes said...

Dear Mugwort,

The standards by which one judges a Roman Catholic bishop are a little different than ordinary folks like you or I.

By now a man of his education and spiritual training has had ample time to review the historical records and reach the obvious conclusion. Argentina has a large Jewish community and a phone call could get him a dozen victims who would personally testify to their experiences.

Instead, he chooses to do research by e-mailing David Irving.

He knows full well that his promise "to do research" was understood by the Catholic world, and his superiors, to mean research the opposite side to his current views.

Instead he hooks up with Lady Renouf.

I must add that the Bishop is in a position, unlike you or I, where he must consider the effect of his every action on the Church.

He has acted with a lot of pride and not much probity.

I do allow that a good number of Catholics don't see this as a problem of natural law and availablity of truth. Many see this as a civil liberty issue.

But to quote an old traditionalist saying "untruth has no rights".

That's the Lefevbrist argument against religious liberty for protestants by the way.

So you see, he is hung by his own petard.

Best Wishes.

MACNEALON said...

Bishop Williamson -I told you before, based on my persona knowledge- sincerely believes what he says.

I also told you of the influence from David Irving. Now it´s clear.

I repeat my suggestion: a sponsor must finance traslations and free ebook versions of Lipstadt´s and Evans´anti-revisionists books. You have no idea about de growing influence of revisionism in South America.

Bye,

M.N.

FAIIRPLAY said...

Quote taken from the Daily Mail, London [Mail On-Line] 26 / 02/ 09:

The Holocaust-denying bishop expelled from Argentina for his 'insulting' views has been invited to stay with controversial historian David Irving.
Bishop Richard Williamson was said to be so worried about being arrested on arrival at Heathrow that he contacted Irving for help.

Irving, who has served a prison sentence in Austria for 'glorifying and identifying with the German Nazi Party', offered to put him up at his home in Windsor and asked socialite Lady Michele Renouf to meet the bishop at Heathrow with extradition lawyers in case he was arrested.

When the bishop arrived he was not arrested, but was flanked by an armed police guard and three private bodyguards. Argentinian authorities had given him ten days to leave the country.

J. Christopher Pryor said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
J. Christopher Pryor said...

Dear Ms. Lipstadt,

Thank you so much for following this story. Years before entering law school, I was in Bishop Williamson's seminary. He had all of these insane ideas then. In addition, he also has friends of those connected to the International Third Position and the European National Front. I believe he is an activist, and not simply a mistaken cleric.

Here is an article I wrote on this topic recently.

http://christopherpryor.blogspot.com/2009/02/have-men-about-me-who-are-fat.html

Thank you again for following this story.

Sincerely,
J. Christopher Pryor
jcpryor@hotmail.com

James Stewart said...

It was never hard to guess what way this was going to go , Renouf and Irving will both play this for what it is worth.
From now on it is headlines that matter all so much as we have seen before and will see again.
Soundbites and headlines , historical fact will soon be lost to sight.
This is "Real History" - history by way of an idiot's charter.